The London production 1

Thought occurred to me, too, Senor - though something tells me that that isn't going to happen - or at least not yet, anyway.

auctioneer wrote:Last day of current cast is Saturday 4 September, and new cast start on Monday 6 September. I believe that Mr Davies is performing for September and October until J...errr....the new Phantom starts.

But does he have any planned dates in August?

And now that Hugh Panaro has announced his return to Broadway Phantom, isn't it time for John Owen Jones to announce his return to West End Phantom?

Oops - sorry, operafantomnet - I misunderstood the question! To be honest, I don't know. I arrive in the UK again next week, though, and I'll see what I can find out when I'm 'round the theatre again.

I agree - it's about time that JOJ's return was announced. To borrow the line from Steve Harley re the delay in announcing his taking the role of Phantom in the original cast, maybe they're "waiting for the moment!"

operafantomet wrote:

auctioneer wrote:Last day of current cast is Saturday 4 September, and new cast start on Monday 6 September. I believe that Mr Davies is performing for September and October until J...errr....the new Phantom starts.

But does he have any planned dates in August?

And now that Hugh Panaro has announced his return to Broadway Phantom, isn't it time for John Owen Jones to announce his return to West End Phantom?

Blast from the past. Next thing you know, Joel Schumacher and ALW will be talking about filming Love Never Dies.

I will be really bummed if JOJ returns. I got really turned off when I read an interview and the question was,"What is your opinion of the Phantom?" And he replied that he doesn't have an opinion of any characters he plays and just does what's in the script.

Now if you look back at MC, in tons of interviews he talked about how he had to go deep within the Phantom's soul and how much he loved the Phantom as a person, etc. Now that's what I think a good actor should always do. If you don't love the character you play or don't even have an opinion on it, then that makes a crappy performer in my book!

Fair enough, Callie Daae. That said, I'll respond just in order to give another take for the purpose of discussion, since it's an interesting argument.

Here's my take: actors have different methods for their portrayals and their managing of their workload. Cudia has also said, for instance, that he has to leave the Phantom on the stage and not take him backstage or home - and that he can't let the character 'get to him.' We must remember that Michael Crawford was the first to play such an iconic character. He was breaking new ground, and he realized that the role would 'make' his career (or, at the very least, re-define the terms of it). His public persona is directly linked to the character of the Phantom of the Opera. It's both more understandable and also in his best interest to comment on his relationship to the character.

Personally speaking, as someone who has seen JOJ perform in the role many times, JOJ is far from a crappy performer. I imagine that the comment to which you refer was made in part because he was in the role for a long time, in the same company, and doing the show eight times a week - and JOJ probably learned to keep himself fresh and sane by not taking the character with him and leaving the interpretive work for the stage. I guess he's not a method actor, which it seems that Crawford certainly was. I've read this sort of comment from a lot of actors who stay in roles for extended periods - Lupone on Evita, for instance.

I too need to comment on the JOJ quote.

The comment came from an interview Ladyghost Sandra did with him, and can be read here:
http://www.ladyghost.com/john.html

I'm positive he means what he said. At the same time, I don't think he meant it as it sounds. JOJ is a dead honest soul, sometimes too honest for his own good, but also refreshingly so. If he felt a performance of his was sub-par, he would say so at the stage door. And what I think he tries to communicate in that interview, is that he didn't consider himself all that special in the role compared to those who had done it before him. He's not re-inventing the role because he's this grand genius. Which in some way is a humble approach. Note what he's saying earlier in the interview:

"I just try to serve the writing and tell the story. I didn't consciously bring anything different to the role - once you start trying to be different for the sake of it you are destined to fall in some way - I just tried my hardest to play the character the way I thought he should be. No gimmicks, just realism".

You can critizise him for not digging deep into the character and baring his soul (AKA method acting), as Crawford, Karrie, Enevold, Wilkinson and others did. But at the same time, he's not indifferent to the character, as that first quote might come off. His approach is that the focus is on the character and not the performer, and his basis is the script. In no way is that the hallmark of a crappy performer.

Well, the thing is when I first read the interview I thought, no wonder his interpenetration is totally wrong. I have seen videos of him via Youtube (I know you can't judge a performance from videos, but it gives me a good idea). He screams in Stranger Than You Dreamt It and in the Final Lair and he doesn't just yell as some Phantom's do, he screams. Me personally, the sound of a grown man screaming is like nails on a chalkboard. I'm sure he's a fine actor in everything else he does, but as the Phantom he's just awful. When I see a Phantom, I want to walk out of the show thinking Christine should have stayed with him. I don't think that about JOJ, he plays the Phantom as an absolute psycho, I can't help but think if I was Christine I would defiantly want to go with Raoul.

I can appreciate that JOJ is not everyone's cup of tea - as with most Phantoms, it's down to personal preference. But to call him 'awful' and 'crappy' is a bit harsh, don't you think?

JOJ is a bona fide fan favourite. If he was that bad, they wouldn't have kept him in the show for so long, would they? Also, take into account the videos you've watched - Stranger and Final Lair. I'd be screaming mad too if a) My dearly beloved had just exposed my repulsive carcass and b) I'd just lost her forever!

If they're the same clips as I think you're referring to, his last show, then obviously he was going for it a bit more that night. He wanted to make an impression. Also, speaking as a trained actor, I completely understand his faithfulness to the script. Some actors work from the inside, others from the outside - meaning some will choose to delve into their psyche to 'find' the character and others will simply work best with what they've got around them, i.e. props, costume, a good script, a talented supporting cast, the orchestra. JOJ obviously prefers to do it this way and, to be fair to him, succeeds a lot more than some of the more mechanical performances I've seen from method actors. There is such a thing as trying too hard, you know?

And as operafantomet said, the role had already been created a long time ago. If anything it would be insulting to try and re-figure the Phantom completely. The blueprint is there, there's no need to try and re-invent the acting wheel with it.

Aaaanyhow, I'm going to get off my high horse, now Sorry if that was a bit strong, I happen to like ol' JOJ, incase you couldn't tell. Each to their own, etc..

RANT!!

Ah, Callie, you and I share a dislike of the screaming. That said, sadly, there have been a large number of screamers over the years in Phantom. Even Ramin Karimloo, my fellow Canadian, could be accused of screaming - particularly late into his run. Though I haven't seen Scott Davies this time around (not yet anyway), I can recall him sobbing and screaming loudly on the stage as the boat drifts off. McGillin screamed regularly, too. However, what I've noticed is that this is often not at all consistent for any given performer. With Ramin, for instance, I found his Phantom deliberate and calculating early in his run, while later in the run, he was much angrier. I think that this can be credited almost entirely to the actor's desire to experiment with the role and to try different things - and with eight shows a week and 400 shows per contract (or so), there are plenty of performances to do so.

The unfortunate thing about the unmentionable videos (which we try not to refer to....even though we all know they're there) is that one performance more than any other is seen as representative of an actor's interpretation. I agree with operafantomnet - I think that JOJ is honest and probably quite humble, too - he isn't the creator of the part, but he tries to do justice to it. I've seen him interpret the role in many different ways. Like Karimloo, he probably tries to act "in the moment" and, therefore, not to reflect too much on his character - especially on his day off. It's a choice, I guess. To each her or his own. Discussions like these are interesting, though, and help remind us of why live theatre is so great - even though you might be used to a performer or a character doing things a certain way, in any given performance, you might just see something you don't expect.

auctioneer is bang-on right, there: internet videos only show you what the actors were feeling that particular night. They don't do justice to their entire run. No performance is ever the same twice!

Just wanted to put in my 2 pennies that JOJ is one of my all-time favourites and I rank him as one of the London greats, even though I think he is better as Valjean.

His main asset, whether he likes it or not, is his voice. I have yet to hear a male voice that I've found more beautiful to listen to.

I think his acting is sorely underrated by those online who may never have seen him live. Compared with Ramin Karimloo, who I thought did the same thing exactly every time towards the end of his run, JOJ's performances were remarkably varied. I could never predict what he'd do in the final scene and I felt the screaming was more than appropriate in 'Stranger'... that first unmasking should be much more overplayed than it is, IMHO, given that's such a crucial moment: an illusion the Phantom has spent months (years?) working on has been wrecked forever. I'm not sure if JOJ read Leroux's book (I think he did but I might have just made that up, honestly can't remember), but there were moments where I thought the acting came straight out of there. His mannerisms and gestures were graceful, dignified and majestic in a way that his successor, Earl Carpenter, tended to manage but Karimloo never did. I loved where he put the emphasis in his lines, he always acted them out. The change from his anger with the 'Insolent boy' line to his tenderness with 'Flattering child...' was remarkably nuanced.

I appreciate JOJ's honesty. Particularly in his comments re the movie (which he didn't like) and LND (he liked the score but thought the story sucked).

I would gladly see him return to the role, although personally I would love to see someone brand new take on the role. Just please no young sexy rock tenor, please...

Callie Daae wrote:Well, the thing is when I first read the interview I thought, no wonder his interpenetration is totally wrong. I have seen videos of him via Youtube (I know you can't judge a performance from videos, but it gives me a good idea). He screams in Stranger Than You Dreamt It and in the Final Lair and he doesn't just yell as some Phantom's do, he screams. Me personally, the sound of a grown man screaming is like nails on a chalkboard. I'm sure he's a fine actor in everything else he does, but as the Phantom he's just awful. When I see a Phantom, I want to walk out of the show thinking Christine should have stayed with him. I don't think that about JOJ, he plays the Phantom as an absolute psycho, I can't help but think if I was Christine I would defiantly want to go with Raoul.

You're allowed to have your opinion, don't misunderstand. But be aware that the screaming wasn't typical for him. He did it for some time, but his portrayal was ever developing. The screaming was one extreme end of what he did on stage, not the only way he did the role. His performance were as varied as the colours of the rainbow, and sometimes that resulted in the screaming you refer to. Sometimes it resulted in downright cursing in STYDI (hahaha, best evvah), sometimes it resulted in hypnotic and gentle singing, sometimes it resulted in a bland Phantom.

He was, for the most, a joy to watch, because his portrayal was so varied. You could be unfortunate and see him in a "boring" mood, or doing it over eagerly, but in general he did a fine Phantom.

I have to echo a lot of what others have said, though JOJ isn't quite in my top favorite list anymore. He always had one of the more primal FL scenes, which I generally like (though the screaming could be over the top at times)--it's very real and from the gut. I also generally really like his MOTN, which is very hypnotic and sensual. I actually am not a huge fan of his voice, and I think the reason he did succeed in the role is because of his acting, not his voice.

Aled_Boyo wrote:I can appreciate that JOJ is not everyone's cup of tea - as with most Phantoms, it's down to personal preference. But to call him 'awful' and 'crappy' is a bit harsh, don't you think?

I didn't mean to be "harsh", but I do have a right to speak my mind and I stand by what I said.

His strong point is his voice (which I'm not that crazy about either). I can't help compare every Phantom with Michael Crawford, I think he played the part absolutely perfect. And I don't think it was just because he originated the role. He is the best actor to have graced the West End and Broadway in the past 20 something years.

I adore JOJ. The tone of his voice is so incredibly gorgeous, which is a pretty general statement, but I can't describe what's so perfect to me about it, but he's one of the few Phantoms' whose voice I love every aspect of.

And agreed about people underrating his acting. I'm seen a lot of Phantoms just not get angry enough, or not sad enough, or not something or other, he's one of those that GETS it.

Hoo boy. You won't get much of an argument out of me that Michael Crawford was likely the best Phantom that we've had, but that said, I've not seem him live in the role, so it's hard for me to say that with any authority. That being said, I've seen Michael Crawford in The Woman in White (in 2004) and in EFX (in the late 90's, I think). Let's just say that I don't agree that he's the best actor to have hit the west end and Broadway in the past twenty years. Best Phantom, I'll buy. But I can't buy it with any authority, as I saw Phantom for the first time in London in 1991. As for whether Michael Crawford is the best actor to grace the west end and Broadway - I think there is probably some competition.

auctioneer wrote: As for whether Michael Crawford is the best actor to grace the west end and Broadway - I think there is probably some competition.

He has won two Olivier Awards, a Tony, and a Drama Desk. I think that is pretty impressive. Also, you're so lucky to have seen him perform! I'm jealous!

Interupting the JOJ talk - actually first of all I've heard it is in fact not JOJ taking over. I don't know, I can't say 100% it isn't but I heard it isn't him anyway.

But yes interupting the JOJ talk as I don't have much of an opinion on him (and personally don't find his Valjean as outstanding as others do, but I like variety in life, would be boring if we were all the same) to say it's Simon's last performance tomorrow as you all know. Is anyone else from here coming along? Just out of interest.

starryeyed wrote:Interupting the JOJ talk - actually first of all I've heard it is in fact not JOJ taking over. I don't know, I can't say 100% it isn't but I heard it isn't him anyway.

I was told by a cast member that it was a brand new face for the Phantom. Then everything went silent. Then the JOJ rumours started swirling. Now I don't know what to think! But I'm very excited nonetheless. And I seriously hope I get to see Scott Davies perform in the mean time...

And, to be honest, I've heard absolutely nothing for about six weeks. Who knows what could have changed/happened since then. Starryeyed, I won't be there on Saturday but will undoubtedly be 'round later next week some time - and, of course, I'll be taking in cast change.

Wait, crap, I didn't realise it was time for Simon's last performance already! I am tempted to go tomorrow evening if I end up having nothing to do -- I need something to relax me. I'm supposed to be meeting up with friends but I have a suspicion that plan is all going to fall apart, in which case do I have much of a chance of getting a seat from TKTS tomorrow afternoon?

I want to see Simon and Gina perform AIAOY one more time...

Auctioneer, when are you thinking of going next?

I actually don't arrive in the UK until early on Wednesday (fly overnight) and then have meetings all day on Thursday and Friday. If I stay awake all day, I might venture to the theatre on Wednesday, but I have my doubts. I would suspect it might well be Friday when I get to the show - or Saturday if I can't get a decent seat (or preferably "my normal seat") for Friday. I can message you once I'm over. I suppose at some point I will have to check out this LND show, too.

auctioneer wrote:I would suspect it might well be Friday when I get to the show - or Saturday if I can't get a decent seat (or preferably "my normal seat") for Friday. I can message you once I'm over.

What's your normal seat? ;-) Yeah do message me, might be interested in tagging along if I don't go tomorrow...always interesting to meet a fellow enthusiast.

I suppose at some point I will have to check out this LND show, too.

I'm rather glad I've stayed away from it. If I went, I would just curse myself afterwards for the money wasted on such a torturous experience.

Put it this way - if the show is not to my liking, I plan on hitting the bar at the interval (the LND, that is, not the original)! I'll tell you my normal seat in person if we meet...I'm suspicious about these things!

starryeyed wrote:it's Simon's last performance tomorrow as you all know. Is anyone else from here coming along? Just out of interest.

I wish I was, but I can't afford it. I wanted to see him and Gina perform together one last time, since I haven't managed to see them together since the cast change performance last year (time flies, I can't believe that was a year ago!)

So let me get this clear in my head. Simon Bailey will leave tomorrow night and Will Barratt will take over as principal Raoul on Monday? And the new cast will start on September 6th, with the new Phantom joining at a later date? Who's going to be starting on September 6th? I know and Scott Davies will be Phantom for a little while and Sophia Escobar is Christine, but I've not heard anything official about the others.

Helen I think it was you that asked about Madame Giry? It's Cheryl McAvoy taking over. This new cast involves a lot of understudy bumping up and a few old faces returning.
I passed on a few people from here and a few well wishers from others to Simon and he said everyone has to come to Passion lol.

Wow - that's a nice refreshing change to hear about in London. There are quite a few ensemble members who have been around forever who haven't been promoted. Glad to hear that this is happening now. Can't wait to hear how the rest of the cast is finally filled out. Starryeyed, can you confirm that Gareth Snook and Barry James are, indeed, staying on for a third year?

Definitely lots of Ensemble bumping up as Anna Cervantes has been promoted to Meg. Cheryl was on last night and I think she's cemented her place as one of my favourite Giry's. Liesl was Meg and I love her!
Yes I can confirm Gareth and Barry are staying for a third year! Both have really upped their game lately and I'm actually glad they are staying on.