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Post  Guest on Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:20 pm

Would you two post pics of what you're talking about, please? Way easier to understand that way...

Swanky--it's the same mold as the other US productions--the cut is different and the wire helps pull it into a different shape...same mold though...

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Post  SenorSwanky on Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:26 pm

Yeah, I think the cut makes a lot of difference. The design depends not just on the mold but how it's cut over the mouth and the hairline and near the ear.
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Post  StrangerThanUDreamt on Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:09 pm

The Crawford mask, which I know is classic; but always seemed a bit too "soft" to me
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The Vegas mask, which I always felt looked more striking, and gaunt
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Post  justin-from-barbados on Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:33 pm

Firstly, Stranger, love your avatar, would like to see the original photo.

Was going to do a whole thing about masks when the whole 'mask worn by Hugh' came up last week.

Each phantom gets his own mask made over the mold of his face. There is talk these days about a 'one size fits all' model that they are using now, which is the latter style Vegas/McGillin style. I dont know how true this is because it seems odd that they would suddenly do this when in London a new Phantom still gets his own mask, and you can clearly see differences in each phantom that uses this 'vegas' style

over the years, there have been 4 distinctly different styles of masks in the US. Although each guy gets a new mask mold made to suit him, depending on when it was done, the sculptor had certain design ques that he stuck to. Maybe the look changed if the actual mask sculptor changed? maybe they changed companies over the years? who knows, but there are 4 styles.

I was going to do a whole photo thing, i might still do it if i have time in the week.

All the names are not here but these are the 4 main groups.

The first style was Crawford style, this was used by Barton also and possibly by Nolan too, but I dont have my list now to check. It has the sleek look and even though going for the porcelain look, to me it looks more like leather, not much hard shapes, very fluid. Not sure if Gulllame follows this aswell because his pics are not very clear.

The second style starts mainly when the first tour started with phantoms like Jacoby, Hilsabeck, D'Ambrosio, Lovett, Gaines, Gray and others, it is when the raised eyebrow appears, but the mask generally still has the 'crawford' cheak (almost like it goes farther down the cheak than nessessary)

The third style was the one I talked about earlier, the O'Leary style where the eyebrow gets all sharp and almost suprised looking, and the side by the ear gets very flat. It should me noted that Hugh still uses this style afterall these years, he was one of the last Phantoms to use it back in the day.

The last style is the McGillin style because he was the first to use it. The vegas style is very simmilar, all depending on how much of the cheak they cut out.
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Post  purplehaze93 on Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:55 pm

heres some better looks at some masks
Steve Barton
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*i love that second barton pic, very elegant.
Robert Guilliame
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hope that helps a bit,
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Post  Guest on Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:22 am

I agree with most of what justin posted.

justin-from-barbados wrote:Was going to do a whole thing about masks when the whole 'mask worn by Hugh' came up last week.

Each phantom gets his own mask made over the mold of his face. There is talk these days about a 'one size fits all' model that they are using now, which is the latter style Vegas/McGillin style. I don't know how true this is because it seems odd that they would suddenly do this when in London a new Phantom still gets his own mask, and you can clearly see differences in each phantom that uses this 'vegas' style.

There are currently several molds that fall into this category. There is a stockpile of the "elongated eyebrow" masks and the "high-arch eyebrow" masks in NYC. I'm told there is a third one, but haven't seen anyone wearing a third mask style. Actors that go in now for a fitting choose the mask that best fits them from the available stock. The masks are then customized to that actor's hairline and face (for the cut) and size (for the wire). The molds used to be individualized, but that has not been the case for a while now.

justin-from-barbados wrote: Over the years, there have been 4 distinctly different styles of masks in the US. Although each guy gets a new mask mold made to suit him, depending on when it was done, the sculptor had certain design ques that he stuck to. Maybe the look changed if the actual mask sculptor changed? maybe they changed companies over the years? who knows, but there are 4 styles.

Agreed. There are four styles of molds.

justin-from-barbados wrote:I was going to do a whole photo thing, i might still do it if i have time in the week.

All the names are not here but these are the 4 main groups.

The first style was Crawford style, this was used by Barton also and possibly by Nolan too, but I don't have my list now to check. It has the sleek look and even though going for the porcelain look, to me it looks more like leather, not much hard shapes, very fluid. Not sure if Guillaume follows this as well because his pics are not very clear.

Agreed. This "Crawford style" mask was used by Crawford, Nolen, Groenendaal, Barton, and Guillaume (plus understudies).

justin-from-barbados wrote:The second style starts mainly when the first tour started with phantoms like Jacoby, Hilsabeck, D'Ambrosio, Lovett, Gaines, Gray and others. It is when the raised eyebrow appears, but the mask generally still has the 'Crawford' cheek (almost like it goes farther down the cheek than necessary)

Agreed. I refer to this mask as the "pronounced eyebrow" mask. It keeps the basic shape of Crawford's mask, but accentuates the eyebrow.

justin-from-barbados wrote:The third style was the one I talked about earlier, the O'Leary style where the eyebrow gets all sharp and almost surprised looking, and the side by the ear gets very flat. It should be noted that Hugh still uses this style after all these years, he was one of the last Phantoms to use it back in the day.

Agreed. I call this the "high-arch eyebrow" mask. Hugh still wears this one because the nose on the fourth style doesn't fit him very well. He told me so.

justin-from-barbados wrote:The last style is the McGillin style because he was the first to use it. The Vegas style is very similar, all depending on how much of the cheek they cut out.

I call this one the "elongated eyebrow" mask, for obvious reasons. This one was used by McGillin, both Vegas principal Phantoms, TMG, Cudia, and various other actors more recently. It really does make a difference on how the mask is cut. Crivello's mask looks kinda blocky, McGillin and Cudia's had the lip scooped out, while TMG, Jason Mills and Richard Todd Adams had the older style lip cut.

So yeah....FOUR types of molds. It's the eyebrow that defines the style of the mask. There are obviously going to be differences in each mask based on who's wearing it. The cut of the mask is based on the actor. The wire can also pull the mask in tight to the cheek, giving it a narrow look.

Any questions? Smile

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Post  SenorSwanky on Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:28 am

Guess that makes sense. Might be the airbrushing as well, but it seems the cheek isn't quite as shaped on the newest mold.
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Post  StrangerThanUDreamt on Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:20 am

justin-from-barbados wrote:Firstly, Stranger, love your avatar, would like to see the original photo.

Thanks! Since I haven't seen it posted before, I suppose it may fall under somewhat rare...

It's a 3D rendering actually, but the detail is phantastic! And I really wish the UK and US productions would do the full-circle style of the chandelier, it really makes a world of difference.
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Post  justin-from-barbados on Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:01 pm

nice pic, would work great in advertising
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Post  London-Phan on Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:25 pm

Just out of curiosity how many styles of mask would you say there have been in the London production? Because I think there's only 2 but can't decide weather there might be 3. The current style has been used definitely( i think) since Grant Norman but may have been earlier as Ethan Freeman's and Peter Polycarpou's look like they may be the current style too but I can't really decide as there isn't that many pics of them.
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Post  justin-from-barbados on Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:05 pm

Ive thought about looking at London, but Ive found that the london masks change somewhat drastically frm actor to actor, even in recent times, Ive even seen actors that styles that are different photo to photo, Dave WIllets comes to mind.
Also alot of the earlier London ones just dont have enough photos around (Norman in particular) or the pictures are so dark and grainy.

here are the US pics

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no brow

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brow

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angry/srprised brow Laughing

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brow over nose

let me apologise now for my bad spelling of actor's names, no disrespect, but alot of them I just dont have their names on file.

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Post  SenorSwanky on Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:13 pm

Nice work. As far as spelling goes, they're all correct except Groenendaal. A lot of people misspell his name, for some reason. I think there's technically an umlaut in there somewhere. Over the "o" or the first "e" maybe?
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Post  operafantomet on Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:27 pm

SenorSwanky wrote:Nice work. As far as spelling goes, they're all correct except Groenendaal. A lot of people misspell his name, for some reason. I think there's technically an umlaut in there somewhere. Over the "o" or the first "e" maybe?
As far as I know, no. You either have the "ö" or the "oe". The E substitutes for the umlaut. Americans tend to think the umlaut should be added to every Germannic word (I'm exaggerating! Sorry), but then you easily end up with a nonsense name like "Häagen-Dazs"...

justin-from-barbados, cool to see those collages. And it reminded me of how much I like the "Crawford" and "McGillin" style, and how much I dislike the "O'Leary" style...

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Post  NightRachel on Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:13 am

Wow -- thanks, justin, for sharing those graphics!
It's really cool to see all the different mask styles next to each other like that...now I can better see what you all were talking about. Smile
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Post  StrangerThanUDreamt on Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:30 am

operafantomet wrote:
SenorSwanky wrote:Nice work. As far as spelling goes, they're all correct except Groenendaal. A lot of people misspell his name, for some reason. I think there's technically an umlaut in there somewhere. Over the "o" or the first "e" maybe?
As far as I know, no. You either have the "ö" or the "oe". The E substitutes for the umlaut. Americans tend to think the umlaut should be added to every Germannic word (I'm exaggerating! Sorry), but then you easily end up with a nonsense name like "Häagen-Dazs"...

justin-from-barbados, cool to see those collages. And it reminded me of how much I like the "Crawford" and "McGillin" style, and how much I dislike the "O'Leary" style...

I agree, the "O'Leary" style is my least favorite, it's way too rounded and lacks the more masculine flair the "McGillin" style has. I still think the "Crawford" suffers from 'droopy jaw' the jaw/mouth area are so much longer than the rest of the mask that it throws the mask out of proportion, and I just always personally thought it looked a little bland.
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Post  operafantomet on Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:06 pm

Beautiful, if somewhat blurry, production photos from Manila here:

http://judebautista.wordpress.com/2012/09/26/the-phantom-of-the-opera-spectacle/

Not by the production itself, it seems. Very in-the-moment photos.

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Post  SenorSwanky on Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:16 pm

They should get Roxmouth to be the next Phantom either in London or on Broadway.
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Post  purplehaze93 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 5:38 pm

SenorSwanky wrote:They should get Roxmouth to be the next Phantom either in London or on Broadway.
There hasn't been a new "fresh" phantom on Broadway in years, so I totally support that idea.
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Post  purplehaze93 on Thu Oct 25, 2012 2:26 am

I found these of the Broadway FaceBook page for Phantom, some pretty cool pics.

Jeff Keller
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Tim Nolan
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Cool pictures from early in Hugh's Broadway Run.
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Post  phan101 on Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:20 pm

For ianjonbourgandethanfreeman- Martin Smith pictures from the october 1989 west end broucher

This is Martin as Red Death (I think...):
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Love this one:
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Jill and Martin:
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Journey:
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(Sorry about size, not sure how to make them small!!!)
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Post  Guest on Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:38 pm

The Red Death pic is from the original London program.

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Post  phan101 on Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:28 pm

phantomfett wrote:The Red Death pic is from the original London program.

Thought it might be, thanks for clearing it up Smile
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Post  charleygirl on Sun Dec 02, 2012 1:14 pm

I saw the show at Her Majesty's again and got a copy of the new brochure yesterday. Very Happy

Mostly new pictures; some pages are the same, so I've not bothered scanning those. Ditto for the images that have already been released. Just as a warning, the files are pretty big!

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It's a shame that the mirror scene has been photoshopped again. Would have been nice to have a completely new picture.

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I did try to paste this one together, but Jeremy's arm and the man behind Lara disappeared off the scanner.

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And as a bonus, the MOTN shot outside the theatre that for some reason isn't included in the brochure. Wish it was, as I'd love a version that doesn't have reflections of the buildings across the street!

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Post  SenorSwanky on Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:42 pm

Beautiful shots, especially the one on the throne.
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Post  purplehaze93 on Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:18 pm

Second last pic, in the Final Lair, is awesome! I love how you can see the pain in his eyes, great details!
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Post  justin-from-barbados on Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:21 pm

Beautiful shots, now just get rid of those awful quotes :"Let me show you hot to love" like really
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Post  MajesticPhantom on Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:56 am

These are gorgeous, gorgeous shots... I can't wait to see this production, again. Lovett looks so old school! Very Happy

I love the Phantom makeup on Lovett... it all seems to fit really well on him, both deformity and beauty!

In general, I am so in love with this record... it is so in tune with the actors' chemistries... so important.
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Post  MajesticPhantom on Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:56 am

SenorSwanky wrote:Beautiful shots, especially the one on the throne.

PS: Might be one of my all-time favorites of the throne canon.
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Post  ML6 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:18 am

Once again, the London production shines when it comes to their pictures. I nearly got into a fight with the admin of the Phantom Broadway page on the account that Joan Marcus' photos are boring, unoriginal and frankly out of date.

Charleygirl's post on those pictures, my eyes go instantly to the one with Raoul and Christine in the final lair. It doesn't look staged, it looks as though they were in the moment when it was caught.
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Post  dramagirl1990 on Mon Jan 07, 2013 12:17 am

I'm pretty sure someone already posted this picture by now but I've been having trouble finding it - it's a black and white photo of Michael Crawford doing that pose where he smooths back his hair. I need it not just for my own selfish longing but for a picture I'm creating. If anyone could find and post it, it would be much appreciated!

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