International productions

Speaking of which, the international POTO Facebook site asked yesterday what languages Phantom has been performed in on stage. They wrote 13 different ones is correct, but which ones? The ones I can think of is:

English, Swedish, Danish, German, Dutch, Flemish, Spanish, Hungarian, Polish, Portugese, Japanese and Korean.

I can't for my bare life figure out what that last language is. Unless they separate between Spanish in Spain and Spanish in Mexico, or German in Germany and German in Austria? Since they list the illegal Russian production in the official site, I suspect they reckon Russian to be the 13th language... Or am I missing something?

For the movie there is of course also Italian and French. But I think they meant stage related?

"To date, Phantom has been produced in 13 different languages around the world. Obviously English is one but who can tell us the other 12?"
https://www.facebook.com/ThePhantomOfTheOpera/posts/10151215018987051

I was racking my brain over that too, but I TOTALLY forgot Hungarian and Polish, I think I am subconsiously blocking those non-replica productions from my universe, lol

I also idnt think to count Flemish as one because I thought (misguidingly so) that the Belgum one was Dutch.

Might they be under the impression over on FB that the Chinese stop was done in Chinese? (even though it was English)

justin-from-barbados wrote:I also idnt think to count Flemish as one because I thought (misguidingly so) that the Belgum one was Dutch.

Flemish and Dutch ARE awfully similar languages. But you know the ol' saying - "A language is a dialect with an army and navy"... Sometimes very similar languages are seen as separate ones (like Dutch and Flemish, or Danish and Norwegian), sometimes they're just seen as variants of the same (like we call "Mexican" for Spanish and "Brazilian" for Portuguese).

A lot of people on FB assumed Phantom had been performed in Chinese (Cantonese/Mandarin) and "African" due to the World Tour visits in China and South Africa. But I think the real issue here is that the official Phantom website lists the Russian one as a legit production, and has added that to their list of languages. Apparently they're a bit in doubt themselves of what the right answer is, because they refuse to comment any further...

I've always wondered, since there was no official Danish recording, how different is Danish from Swedish?
Generally speaking can people in each country understand the language of the next country? (Danish, Swedish, Norwegian)
I have always wondered since the Scandinavian block has always seemed as such a tight little union.

justin-from-barbados wrote:I've always wondered, since there was no official Danish recording, how different is Danish from Swedish?
Generally speaking can people in each country understand the language of the next country? (Danish, Swedish, Norwegian)
I have always wondered since the Scandinavian block has always seemed as such a tight little union.

Danish is way different from Swedish. It's somehow mutually intelligible in text, but the pronounciation in Danish is very different. We Finns call it sounding like "Swedish spoken with a hot potato in one's mouth". Norwegian and Swedish are more similar, but not exactly mutually intelligible.

justin-from-barbados wrote:I've always wondered, since there was no official Danish recording, how different is Danish from Swedish?
Generally speaking can people in each country understand the language of the next country? (Danish, Swedish, Norwegian)
I have always wondered since the Scandinavian block has always seemed as such a tight little union.

Well, that's quite a different debate, but I'll do my best to make a long story short... Swedish and Danish doesn't sound alike, and their spelling is different. But most can talk with eachother and be understood, as the basic lexicality and grammar is recognizable.

Norway is somewhere in between. Grammar and spelling is nearly identical to Danish (well, roughly so), but the pronunciation is much more similar to Swedish. Danish pronunciation is a matter of its own... So technically all Swedes, Danes and Norwegians can communicate with eachother in their native language and be understood. These three combined could easily make it into a pan Scandinavian language, had there not been borders and a national identity to deal with. There were plans of this Scandinavian kingdom in the 19th century, but for different reasons it never happened. There's still a close connection and intertwined political interests between the countries, though.

Listening to Phantom in Danish and Phantom in Swedish isn't miles apart, but as mentioned the way of pronouncing words (though the words might or might not be the same) is different. The Danes are WAY softer on the consonants, for example. They also used different translations.

Ok thanks, I just love my Swedisn CD, just something about how they sound (Elizabeth Berg is my alltime favourite Christine vocally) It is my go to recording when I'm stressed or in a lousy mood and need a good relaxing

operafantomet wrote:

justin-from-barbados wrote:I've always wondered, since there was no official Danish recording, how different is Danish from Swedish?
Generally speaking can people in each country understand the language of the next country? (Danish, Swedish, Norwegian)
I have always wondered since the Scandinavian block has always seemed as such a tight little union.

Well, that's quite a different debate, but I'll do my best to make a long story short... Swedish and Danish doesn't sound alike, and their spelling is different. But most can talk with eachother and be understood, as the basic lexicality and grammar is recognizable.

Norway is somewhere in between. Grammar and spelling is nearly identical to Danish (well, roughly so), but the pronunciation is much more similar to Swedish. Danish pronunciation is a matter of its own... So technically all Swedes, Danes and Norwegians can communicate with eachother in their native language and be understood. These three combined could easily make it into a pan Scandinavian language, had there not been borders and a national identity to deal with. There were plans of this Scandinavian kingdom in the 19th century, but for different reasons it never happened. There's still a close connection and intertwined political interests between the countries, though.

Listening to Phantom in Danish and Phantom in Swedish isn't miles apart, but as mentioned the way of pronouncing words (though the words might or might not be the same) is different. The Danes are WAY softer on the consonants, for example. They also used different translations.

It´s truly sad that there´s no danish CD. I know the reasons but it´s sad. As well now for LND. The cast would deserve it.

so there isn;t going to be a Danish LND recording either?

justin-from-barbados wrote:so there isn;t going to be a Danish LND recording either?

Alas no. They claim they don't have the rights to do so. I'm guessing it would be easy enough to OBTAIN the rights. But Det Ny Teater is more like an independent opera house. They don't have a production team renting their theatre, instead they choose their own repertoire, they make all costume and sets in house, they have a permanent orchestra and conductor etc. This means an eventual recording would have to be fully licenced and paid for by the theatre, and I can fully understand they don't dare to explore that adventure, in a country with some 5,5 million inhabitants. The market is too small, and they're a private theatre surviving without official budget fundings.

Would they sell a lot of an LND recording abroad? Definitely. But I'm not sure it would be enough to finance the project. Too bad they don't have an Andrew lloyd Webber wanting to film and release it...

ok makes sence

operafantomet wrote:

justin-from-barbados wrote:so there isn;t going to be a Danish LND recording either?

Alas no. They claim they don't have the rights to do so. I'm guessing it would be easy enough to OBTAIN the rights. But Det Ny Teater is more like an independent opera house. They don't have a production team renting their theatre, instead they choose their own repertoire, they make all costume and sets in house, they have a permanent orchestra and conductor etc. This means an eventual recording would have to be fully licenced and paid for by the theatre, and I can fully understand they don't dare to explore that adventure, in a country with some 5,5 million inhabitants. The market is too small, and they're a private theatre surviving without official budget fundings.

Would they sell a lot of an LND recording abroad? Definitely. But I'm not sure it would be enough to finance the project. Too bad they don't have an Andrew lloyd Webber wanting to film and release it...

That´s really true..they should have an Andrew Lloyd Webber who wants to film it.
It´s an amazing production! I´m glad that I see it again in April.

I apologize in advance if these have been posted before.

I just came across some nice pictures from a Hungarian site after reading operafantomet's post about the Elissa costume used in the non-replica production in Budapest.

I'm not really familiar with the cast aside from Andrea Mahó and Renáta Krassy, so I would appreciate if someone could help me identify the rest.


Andrea Mahó


Andrea Mahó and Patrícia Kuthy?


Andrea Mahó


Andrea Mahó and Zóltan Miller?
(Wait, I thought he played Phantom, was he Raoul too?)


?
(For some reason, I really like this photo)


Attila Csengeri


Barbara Fonyó and ?

@nynaevealmeera: Zoltan played both - Raoul and Fantom.
Under Zoltan you have Sandor Sasvari and Andrea Maho.

Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

Thanks for sharing, I am more interested in non replica so I will see hopefully soon Poland and the finnish one.
But I take Prague too because its close to my home...Prague will be a replica version.

SweetChristine wrote:

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

Thanks for sharing, I am more interested in non replica so I will see hopefully soon Poland and the finnish one.
But I take Prague too because its close to my home...Prague will be a replica version.

I didn't realise the Prague production was going to be a replica one! If so, I'm there.

Scorp wrote:

SweetChristine wrote:

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

Thanks for sharing, I am more interested in non replica so I will see hopefully soon Poland and the finnish one.
But I take Prague too because its close to my home...Prague will be a replica version.

I didn't realise the Prague production was going to be a replica one! If so, I'm there.

Same! I had thought it was going to be a non-replica. Will definetly visit.

Some rumors have started circulating in the Russian fandom that the upcoming Moscow one will use the restaged design. Since it will be produced by Stage Entertainment, which has the rights to the replica version, I'd think they'd go with the replica one. Also, SE has never been interested in restaged versions of popular shows. They have mounted and are still mounting replica productions of Tanz der Vampire, when the Kentaur craze swept over the show.

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:

Scorp wrote:

SweetChristine wrote:

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

Thanks for sharing, I am more interested in non replica so I will see hopefully soon Poland and the finnish one.
But I take Prague too because its close to my home...Prague will be a replica version.

I didn't realise the Prague production was going to be a replica one! If so, I'm there.

Same! I had thought it was going to be a non-replica. Will definetly visit.

Some rumors have started circulating in the Russian fandom that the upcoming Moscow one will use the restaged design. Since it will be produced by Stage Entertainment, which has the rights to the replica version, I'd think they'd go with the replica one. Also, SE has never been interested in restaged versions of popular shows. They have mounted and are still mounting replica productions of Tanz der Vampire, when the Kentaur craze swept over the show.

They've received very vocal criticism from audiences though in Germany with the Hamburg revival, which apparently isn't pleasing fans with the casting and, most significantly, with the orchestra, which has been halved.

The original is expensive to mount so it wouldn't surprise me if Cameron now tries to make the restaged one take over the world like the restaged Les Mis is currently attempting...

Yes I had asked and if I know more about Prague I let you know, but it will be a replica version.
Will see how it will look like in Moscow.

SweetChristine wrote:

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

Thanks for sharing, I am more interested in non replica so I will see hopefully soon Poland and the finnish one.
But I take Prague too because its close to my home...Prague will be a replica version.

They have released a couple of costume sketches for the Prague production. The costumes are definitely not replica. So this seems to be a conflict of information?

http://www.fantomopery.cz/2013/12/pro-fantoma-opery-se-jiz-rodi-stovky-kostymu-za-miliony/

I do like the different re-interpretations of POTO. But I wish that ONE country in the easternmore part of Europe could do a replica version. I'd love to see and hear the original in more languages and with a different flair while still keeping the original staging. I like how very different the (for example) Japanese, Danish and Brazilian versions were. But I guess we'll see more non-replica versions in the future, as it's both a way for theatres/production companies to show their own production skills, and it can be cheaper (not saying the non replica productions are cheap, JFTR).

operafantomet wrote:

SweetChristine wrote:

TheFinnishPhantom wrote:Two new productions have been announced recently:

2014 - Moscow (most likely a replica) German article: clicky
2015 - Helsinki (non-replica) Theater's annoucement (in Finnish): clicky

Very excited about both! The Helsinki production will be at the Finnish National Opera, and the creative team seems very promising. The show will be performed in English, and the house is looking for an international casting.

In addition to the Hamburg production, the recent Polish revival and the upcoming one in Prague, POTO is having a bit of a revival. Mostly non-replicas, but I'm happy to have at least something.

Thanks for sharing, I am more interested in non replica so I will see hopefully soon Poland and the finnish one.
But I take Prague too because its close to my home...Prague will be a replica version.

They have released a couple of costume sketches for the Prague production. The costumes are definitely not replica. So this seems to be a conflict of information?

http://www.fantomopery.cz/2013/12/pro-fantoma-opery-se-jiz-rodi-stovky-kostymu-za-miliony/

You are right but they gave me the information but now it looks like a non replica version

And another non-replica production has been announced, this time a touring production in Estonia (Ooperifantoom!), with stops in Tarto and Tallinn in 2014 and 2015. Strangely, it was announced in 2012, and has been largely unnoticed until recently.

Georg Malvius will direct and his long time collaborator, Ellen Cairns will design the sets and costumes. Couldn't be happier - I saw Les Misérables directed and designed by them in Turku, Finland 16 times, and will plan on seeing the new Finnish and Danish productions too. Just love their work.

Cast and more information can be found here (in English): clicky

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUB2ByePGA4

so glad that there is a new produciton of the original out there in a new language (well one not done before) lets hope there will be a CD.

the trailer looks cool too, fresh and colourful.
some interesting things I saw:
is it me or did the chandelier look round in that first shot? maybe it's just the angle
like Broadway they seem to have the candelabra lit in that nice turquoise light, a small touch that I;ve always found great in the NYC production, hopefully it was not just done here for the filming.

While I am still not 100% sold on these new red death masks, I am happy beyond words that the phantom's mask does not look like some of the more recent euro clunkers, such as Essen and Antwerp, reminds me alot too of the world tour masks (which I am also not a huge fan of, but it looks really nice

I do hope it does not end up being a 6 - 12 month production, these days shows hardly seem to have nice long runs anymore

Thanks for posting that, Justin. It looks great, and sounds really good in Russian.

Well, what a lovely tall Phantom!

But his voice...I dunno. This could very well be my elderly computer and its crummy speakers, but his voice sounds weirdly...electronic? Auto-tuned, maybe? It seems too high and tinny, and just didn't seem to have much strength or depth. He sounds rather like a boy. or like the opera singer Juan Diego Flores, who is a current darling of the opera world but whom I can't stand. I think this guy would be great as Raoul, but I want thundering majesty and absolute power in the Phantom when he's singing loudly, and insidious, irresistible command during the soft bits. But again, bad sound system, so maybe he's great as the Phantom. I wish I could hear more of his singing. If they release more clips of him I'll make sure to watch them. And he is certainly awwwwwfully sexy the way he stands in the boat with one foot behind him...

But Christine is beautiful, and the production looks good. If only they'd bring the original production back to tour in the U.S.

The Countess

That footage looks BEAUTIFUL! Love that we have another replica production out there. Their Phantom is TALL.

Funny how no one has noticed the fact that Stage Entertainment apparently is planning a production in Paris.

In the program for the Hamburg production Joop Van Den Ende (CEO) writes his welcome to the audience and his relation to the Phantom. He ends one paragraph with: "Stage Entertainment ist stolz darauf, das Musical seit den 1990er Jahren in jeweils landessprachlichen Produktionen in den Niederlanden, Deutschland und Spanien zu zeigen. Weitere Produktionen in unseren Theatern in Paris und Moskau sollen Zeitnah folgen."

Which in a bad translation translates to: "Stage Entertainment is proud of it, to have shown the musical since the 1990s in each local language productions in the Netherlands, Germany and Spain. Other productions in our theaters in Paris and Moscow will Promptly follow."

Well, Moscow has opened, is the Phantom finally getting home? I don't see why he should announce it like that if he wasn't sure about it happening. And seeing that Tanz Der Vampire is getting good reviews in Paris now I don't see why they wouldn't dare.

In my personal opinion I think Phantom in Paris could be quite cool. Because, well, that's where the story takes place! Also the Theatre Mogadór is placed right behind the Opera Garnier, which would just bring him closer to home.

But only if Van Den Ende speaks the truth, of course.

Oh I do hope this news is true! It would be SO awesome to have a POTO production in Paris! And if it were to happen, it would be a great excuse to visit Paris again.
But regardless, for years I've wanted there to be a French-language production of POTO -- I've been dying to see/hear the entire production performed in French, so I really hope a production does open in Paris in the near future.

ThePhantomOfNorway wrote:Funny how no one has noticed the fact that Stage Entertainment apparently is planning a production in Paris.

In the program for the Hamburg production Joop Van Den Ende (CEO) writes his welcome to the audience and his relation to the Phantom. He ends one paragraph with: "Stage Entertainment ist stolz darauf, das Musical seit den 1990er Jahren in jeweils landessprachlichen Produktionen in den Niederlanden, Deutschland und Spanien zu zeigen. Weitere Produktionen in unseren Theatern in Paris und Moskau sollen Zeitnah folgen."

Which in a bad translation translates to: "Stage Entertainment is proud of it, to have shown the musical since the 1990s in each local language productions in the Netherlands, Germany and Spain. Other productions in our theaters in Paris and Moscow will Promptly follow."

Well, Moscow has opened, is the Phantom finally getting home? I don't see why he should announce it like that if he wasn't sure about it happening. And seeing that Tanz Der Vampire is getting good reviews in Paris now I don't see why they wouldn't dare.

In my personal opinion I think Phantom in Paris could be quite cool. Because, well, that's where the story takes place! Also the Theatre Mogadór is placed right behind the Opera Garnier, which would just bring him closer to home.

But only if Van Den Ende speaks the truth, of course.

I didn't even read that bit of the Hamburg brochure... I hope this is serious. It would be a dream come true to have the original play Paris! If it does, I want there to be a cast recording! And hopefully with a better translation than either of those two attempts that were done for the dubs of the film-that-shall-not-be-named.