phantomoftheopera.com - the site has disappeared

Thanks for the tip Paula, but are you actually getting the threads themselves? I haven't time to try waybackmachine very much, but I can get the site overview, sometimes a forum overview, but not the actual threads and their contents.

If anyone finds a page from the old site via the Waybackmachine, could they perhaps post a link to it here?

I am gutted over the loss. There was such a lot of material on the site. About Phantom in ALL its forms, not just the musical.

Since I referred to information posted on the site in my book, I *did* save down some of the threads to my computer, or printed them out. So that the sources could be verified if need be.

What rules/laws apply to information saved in this way? Could I repost it on the internet as it is?

In my book translating "The Magic Envelope" http://www.amazon.com/The-Phantom-Opera-Envelope-rediscovered/dp/1499657005  (the first into British English by a Swede    !!!  Caitlin Freeman did the first translation into American English)  I have included a post from phantomoftheopera.com as an appendix. This I reproduced with the kind permission of falluke-elskeren who had originally posted it on phantomoftheopera.com.

Same thing here- I can pull up the forum subjects but when I try to get into a thread it says it isn't archived. Then again, I didn't try going back earlier than 2013. I'll try some earlier years and see what happens.

Just to let you know that I'm revising my book, "The Phantom of the Opera - The Magic Envelope" and will be including a new appendix about phantomoftheopera.com.

Does anyone have any suggestions about what to include in the appendix? I'll briefly describe the history of the site, and give an overview of the forums. As documentation to a paradise lost and an epitaph... (melodramatic, aren't I? )

mesadallas wrote:Same thing here- I can pull up the forum subjects but when I try to get into a thread it says it isn't archived. Then again, I didn't try going back earlier than 2013. I'll try some earlier years and see what happens.

I was able to bring them up but only got as far as November 2013. Kind of slow, but it works.

I had a question. Is there anything in the works about maybe having a new forum?

Ya-Chai, are you actually getting the threads themselves, or just forum overviews? Could you post a link for us to one of your searches?

I don't think a new "phantomoftheopera.com" is in the works. The domain name is now taken by RUG/Andrew Lloyd Webber. The contents of the site, the databases with all the information are in the hands of Karin Willison, who used to own the domain name, but I don't know what her plans are.

Jennie wrote:Ya-Chai, are you actually getting the threads themselves, or just forum overviews? Could you post a link for us to one of your searches?

I don't think a new "phantomoftheopera.com" is in the works. The domain name is now taken by RUG/Andrew Lloyd Webber. The contents of the site, the databases with all the information are in the hands of Karin Willison, who used to own the domain name, but I don't know what her plans are.

Hi Jennie-I actually got in. I remember because the display was flat rather than threaded. Here's one I got into:

http://www.phantomoftheopera.com/site/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=1043&forum=8. This was for the topic, "My Leroux-based comic series".

I could not get into all of them either, but I was able to get into the one above.

Hmmm.... don't understand why this sometimes works and sometimes not, but here's an archived thread from the waybackmachine... Christine Daaé and all things Swedish...

http://web.archive.org/web/20071025010439/http://www.phantomoftheopera.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=7393&forum=2

FYI, I found this site by Googling "what happened to phantomoftheopera.com" or something along those lines. I've been a (not very active) member of Phantomfans, Phansonline, and POTO.com, and the last of them disappearing finally lead me here. *waves*

Hi Sarah, welcome.  This site is much quieter than the "lost" forum, but gradually more people are finding their way here.  It's nice to have a home to go to  

Mary

It is a truth universally acknowledged that a single phan in possession of a large obsession must be in want of a companion...

The Countess (who could not resist)

Thanks for the welcome Mary. Quieter is OK. I'm one of those people who wants to read everything and sometimes got a bit overwhelmed by all the discussions I wanted to read over there. So many threads, so little time!

And yes, Countess, that is a universally acknowledged truth.

Hello Sarah, and welcome to Deserted Phans. Yes, it can be pretty quiet here, but I attribute that to the general migration of phans to other social media platforms. The good part is that forums like this are much more focused we're all of one general fanbase and rarely move off-topic. It can make for more in-depth discussions.

R.

Raphael wrote:Hello Sarah, and welcome to Deserted Phans. Yes, it can be pretty quiet here, but I attribute that to the general migration of phans to other social media platforms. The good part is that forums like this are much more focused we're all of one general fanbase and rarely move off-topic. It can make for more in-depth discussions.

R.

Hi Sarah and everyone else!

Good point, Raphael, about more in-depth discussions being possible on sites like this.....

Thanks for welcoming me everyone!

I'm a big fan of your art, Raphael. I feel like I'm meeting a POTO celebrity.

I prefer forums like this to social media when it comes to fan discussions. It's much easier to sort through what you do and don't want to read. And the in-depth discussions were my favorite thing about POTO.com, so I look forward to reading and joining in on them here too. Facebook groups (at least the ones I found) seem to be mostly limited to "OMG lok @ my cul new stuf frm ebay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11" and drooling over pictures. Not to say those are bad things, but I miss the intellectual discussions about what ifs and little details in the books, musicals, and movies.

Anyway, I'm not trying to hijack this thread or anything, just saying hi and letting everyone know that people can find this board when sleuthing around to find out what happened to POTO.com, even though the title doesn't scream Phantom of the Opera.

Sarah Crawford wrote:Anyway, I'm not trying to hijack this thread or anything, just saying hi and letting everyone know that people can find this board when sleuthing around to find out what happened to POTO.com, even though the title doesn't scream Phantom of the Opera.

True, it's not the most obvious name for a Phantom of the Opera fan forum, but it is apropos - we're all deserted phans here

R.

Sarah Crawford wrote:Thanks for welcoming me everyone!

I'm a big fan of your art, Raphael. I feel like I'm meeting a POTO celebrity.  

I prefer forums like this to social media when it comes to fan discussions. It's much easier to sort through what you do and don't want to read. And the in-depth discussions were my favorite thing about POTO.com, so I look forward to reading and joining in on them here too. Facebook groups (at least the ones I found) seem to be mostly limited to "OMG lok @ my cul new stuf frm ebay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11" and drooling over pictures. Not to say those are bad things, but I miss the intellectual discussions about what ifs and little details in the books, musicals, and movies.

This statement pretty well sums up the situation....

Anyway, I'm not trying to hijack this thread or anything, just saying hi and letting everyone know that people can find this board when sleuthing around to find out what happened to POTO.com, even though the title doesn't scream Phantom of the Opera.

Glad to see you here, and everyone else who has joined.

The name of this very nice site doesn't exactly come up as number one in searches when looking for fan sites for Phantom of the Opera.... I've actually bought a couple of domain names, phantomoftheopera.today and thephantomoftheopera.today, where I'm going to set up just a presentation page redirecting people to this site. Just to help people find it.

Jennie wrote:I've actually bought a couple of domain names, phantomoftheopera.today and thephantomoftheopera.today, where I'm going to set up just a presentation page redirecting people to this site. Just to help people find it.

Good thinking, Jennie!  That's very creative (and generous) of you.

Mary

MarySkater wrote:

Jennie wrote:I've actually bought a couple of domain names, phantomoftheopera.today and thephantomoftheopera.today, where I'm going to set up just a presentation page redirecting people to this site. Just to help people find it.

Good thinking, Jennie!  That's very creative (and generous) of you.

Mary

Agreed! Very thoughtful of you Jeannie.

Thanks Mary and Sarah. Am tearing my hair over trying to set up the homepage though. Have never made one! No frills or fancy stuff, just some basic information, hopefully helping to direct people to this site, and others I can find with Phantom-related discussions. As far as time allows.

Was very upset when the old fan site... "died" and RUG took over. No offense intended to either RUG or ALW. He's the man who introduced me to the story of Phantom. Without the musical I don't know if I'd discovered Leroux, and the variations of the original story. Am most grateful to him, and of course I loff the musical. Unreservedly and passionately.

And it's up http://phantomoftheopera.today/

Basically it's just a redirection sign to this site, to help people find it... when I have time I'll be adding more information to it.

All suggestions welcome, but please remember I am "technically challenged" ie not very good at computers or the Internetz.....

Hi Jennie,

Many thanks for doing this. You're right that it's good to have something to help people find this site.

I've had a chance now to try the links.  Here are a few comments, for next time you edit the page.  (I've never set up a website myself, so I can't help with the technicalities.  Just getting it as far as you have, you're already much better than me.   )

I wondered why it said "Hem" in the top right corner, but now I realise that should be "Home."  Can you change that for us English-only people, or is it fixed by the web space provider?

I don't know how useful the "Internet Archive" is;  I can get up the sections with lists of threads, but I can't open any of the threads.  Is anyone else having more luck with that?  Maybe it's my browser or something.  But if nobody can open threads, maybe you should add a little text on your site's home page to say something like, "The details have been lost, but this will give you an idea of the range of subjects which were covered."

The sentence "Read the first installment online..." looks like a link when I mouse over it, but if I click, I get "web page not available."  The "Showing here" part is the true link, which works fine.

Also, the small-text web address for Deserted Phans below the "Once upon a time" paragraph looks like a link when I mouse over it, but it isn't one. Nothing happens when I click it. However, the big link for Desertedphans near the top of the page is fine.

The scan of the newspaper page with the first installment is interesting. Do you think it might be worth adding links to the French text online?  I found it here:
http://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Le_Fant%C3%B4me_de_l%E2%80%99Op%C3%A9ra

Or to the online English version (de Mattos translation):
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/175/175-h/175-h.htm
- maybe with a note to say that there are other translations, and this one is somewhat abridged.

Anyway, thanks again for doing this.  I think it's a great project.

Mary

Hi Mary, thanks for your input, will go see what I can do...

MarySkater wrote:Hi Jennie,

Many thanks for doing this. You're right that it's good to have something to help people find this site.

I've had a chance now to try the links.  Here are a few comments, for next time you edit the page.  (I've never set up a website myself, so I can't help with the technicalities.  Just getting it as far as you have, you're already much better than me.   )

LOL, I've been tearing my hair out over this, don't really like computers or the Internetz, only the love of Phantom has brought me this far. Seriously! The things I do for our Erik.....

Will see if I can sort out the "hem" issue...

The Internet Archive is surprisingly informative once you get the hang of it.... it saves down the sites at certain intervals, and depending on which forum or level of the site happens to be showing just then, you can actually go into some of the threads at times... Am not sure if it's actually allowed to hotlink/link directly to the IA.... if so, then I can put up some more interesting links. Will try to find out. For the time being I will add your comment about the page shown giving an idea of the range....

Good idea to link to online versions of Phantom....

I do want to do more to the .today site, but it takes time to learn, and I don't have enough of that particular currency....

Thanks again for your input, Mary...

Hi everyone. A long time (well, maybe four-five years) ago, I used to post a lot on the old forum. Just decided to have a look tonight for nostalgia's sake and was pretty sad to discover it had gone. But I found this site pretty quickly - thanks Jennie! (And hi - really made me smile to see your name again after so long!)
Here's to the indestructability of phandom, in its many forms. :-)

Hello 2asd2asd, I too, smiled to see your name! Nice to see you again .

Yes, the fandom is indestructible, it's come through so many changes over the years. I was devastated when the old site disappeared, haven't quite got my breath back yet. Have been busy with Phantom in other ways, though.

Welcome, please do spread the word about this site, if you're in touch with other Phantom fans!

Countess of Rothes wrote:It is a truth universally acknowledged that a single phan in possession of a large obsession must be in want of a companion...

The Countess (who could not resist)

[Enter huge grinning smilie here]

For those interested... I've made an attempt at describing the old phantomoftheopera.com fan site, from genesis to demise... to the best of my ability, based on personal knowledge, information from the owners, admin, and data retrieved from various sources... I've put all this into an appendix in my book, in an attempt to "preserve the information for posterity". Sounds a bit pretentious, but there you go... Am posting this appendix in this thread for those interested.

All comments, corrections, additions, suggestions welcome. The text below is an appendix in my book The Magic Envelope. I published a Swedish version at the beginning of 2014, an English version in the summer of 2014, just before phantomoftheopera.com disappeared completely. Since then I've revised the English version, and added this appendix to try to describe it, since I referred to it so frequently in the book.

APPENDIX F
phantomoftheopera.com February 1999 – June 2014
The fan site for “Phantom in all its forms”

This description and history of the fan site phantomoftheopera.com is compiled from information posted on the site itself, messages from the site owners and administration, and from the author’s personal knowledge of the site. The author of this book worked as a moderator on the fan site from 2009 until it disappeared from the Internet in June 2014.

Some of the information has been retrieved from the Internet archive of the WaybackMachine, some has been saved by members of the site before its disappearance. Given the restricted accessibility of these sources, not all of them are included in the bibliography. Anyone wishing to consult them, or who wishes to contribute with information is welcome to contact the author at lena dot gastonleroux at gmail dot com.

The Internet site phantomoftheopera.com was originally a discussion site for Phantom fans created by Karin Willison, but since the domain name was bought by RUG in July 2014 it now redirects to the Internet site for Andrew Lloyd Webber’s musical about the Phantom. In 2013 Willison had moved the site to a different hosting service and intended to set it up on Wordpress, since it was currently running on outdated software. It is unclear why Willison’s ownership of the domain name expired, enabling RUG to buy it.

The homepage of first version of the fan site in 1999 was a direct reference and homage to Leroux’s story. It showed the masked Phantom angrily declaring “You try my patience, make your choice!” and pointing to images of a scorpion and a grasshopper. Clicking on the grasshopper brought up a page saying “Boom!!!! You just blew up the Paris Opera house”, whereas clicking on the scorpion brought up an overview of the site contents. This welcomed the visitor to the “Virtual Paris Opera, where you will find Phantom images, online fiction, information and more ‘hidden’ within the labyrinthine world of the Paris Opera House.” The site featured among other things an image gallery, a chat room, and a Phantom mailing list which pre-dated the site, having been set up as early as 1995.

2005 was a watershed in the history of the site. Evolving over the years, phantomoftheopera.com had now settled into the forum structure described in this appendix. Karin Willison and Christine Daaé were the declared co-owners of the site. Christine Daaé ran it with the help of the administrator and site developer CeBepuH, and a team of moderators.
Given its name, it was easy to find on the Internet, and hosted a lively community of Phantom fans. Catering to “fans of Phantom in all its forms”, it jokingly claimed to have served the Phantom community since the 19th C. Leroux-purist fans would point out that the major objection to this claim was NOT the fact that the Internet did not exist in the 19th C, but the fact that The Phantom of the Opera was written in 1909, i.e. the 20th C.

The site was divided into subsections, called forums. Forums were removed or added as needs arose. For example, an early forum for roleplaying, the “Bal Masque” (masked ball) was removed because it took too much bandwidth. The “Perros Graveyard” forum for locked threads was set up after the launch of Joel Schumacher’s 2004 film adaptation of the ALW musical. The film had resulted in a large influx of new fans who started numerous duplicate threads. Instead of deleting these or other offending threads on sight, the moderating team locked them and moved them to Perros, leaving them visible for reference and as warning examples.

Below is a list of the forums, with their descriptions, as they appeared on the site just before it vanished in June 2014. The forum names often associated to Phantom in various ways, such as for example “The Lair” referring to the Phantom’s underground dwelling.

The Managers' Office
“Questions, comments or complaints about the site and forums. If you have technical problems with the site try asking for help here. Check this forum regularly for site related announcements. Report threads that are offending the rules here.”

Perros Graveyard (visible only to users when logged in)
“The forum for locked threads in purgatory, before being permanently deleted from the site.”

Backstage (visible only to administrators and moderators)
The forum for the owners, administrator and moderators of the site, used for discussing the running of the site. Sometimes controversial threads were moved Backstage and out of sight while the moderating team decided how to deal with them.

The Opera House
“Andrew Lloyd Webber's Phantom of the Opera on stage, and the performances in it. (Movie discussion does not belong in this forum.) For Love Never Dies, go to the Coney Island subforum.”

Coney Island (a subforum to the Opera House)
“For discussions about Andrew Lloyd Webber’s musical Love Never Dies.”
Author’s note: Andrew Lloyd Webber describes this musical as a sequel to the Phantom of the Opera, a definition that some fans do not accept. LND, set in New York on Coney Island, has given rise to mixed reactions from Phantom fans.

Silver Screen
“The 2004 movie of Andrew Lloyd Webber's musical, its cast, pro and con.”

The Lair
“Every other version of Phantom - the books, movies, other stage shows, other phantom related music, anything Phantom but not Lloyd Webber.”

Angel of Music
“Post and discuss poetry, art and other phantom related creative work. Requests for phantom banners, wallpapers and avatars belong here.
Phan fics belong in the Compositions subforum!”

Compositions (subforum to Angel of Music)
“Post and discuss phan fiction. Before posting your phan fic read our requirements for all fics in this forum.”

Center Stage
“A place for all non-Phantom theatre chat. Discuss theatre, musicals, plays that are not phantom related.”

The Dressing Room
“Discuss all actors and actresses (outside of their performances in Phantom); pursuing a career in the theatre; the business of art. If you are interested in singing try looking for answers to your questions here.”

The Chorus
“Anything not related to theatre or Phantom. Discuss Life, the Universe and Everything Else. Newbies please introduce in the 'New here?' thread.”

The Auction
“A place to talk about, buy, and sell Phantom collectibles, merchandise and programs.”

Maze of Mirrors
“Humour, fun, and fluff. Jokes, lists, games. Do not post 'X vs. Y' threads as those would be locked and deleted on sight. Try being original and do not post a little modified lists/fun/fluff/games stuff that has already been done here.”

In 2014 the site hosted almost nine thousand discussion topics, or “threads” and members had made a total of over half a million posts in these threads. Willison’s rights to the domain name having expired, the name was put up for auction, and purchased by RUG, despite attempts by fans to buy it. So from July 2014 the Internet site phantomoftheopera.com is no longer a site for discussions about Phantom in all its forms, but redirects to the RUG site that promotes the Andrew Lloyd Webber musical of the same name.

The fan site phantomoftheopera.com (February 1999 to June 2014) served not only as a platform for open discussions about Phantom in all its forms. Thanks to the combined contributions of its members over the years it was also a goldmine of information about the story that has inspired so many.

It is the author’s opinion that the disappearance of Willison’s and Daaé’s fan site phantomoftheopera.com is a great loss to the Phantom community.

I wondered what had happened to it! :-( Sad to hear it's gone! I was only sporatically active there, partly because I didn't always find the lay-out the easiest to navigate with screen-readers. But still, it was a wonderful place! And I hope Karyn Wilison's OK?

:-) Glad this site's still kicking, though! I gather a lot of Phan activity's moved to Tumblr these days? But Tumblr's an accessibility nightmare! So I really hope this forum hangs in. It's really wonderful to have a user-friendly place to discuss POTO! :-) And will do my bit to help publicize too.

Blind Phan wrote:I wondered what had happened to it!  :-( Sad to hear it's gone!  I was only sporatically active there, partly because I didn't always find the lay-out the easiest to navigate with screen-readers.  But still, it was a wonderful place!  And I hope Karyn Wilison's OK?

:-) Glad this site's still kicking, though!  I gather a lot of Phan activity's moved to Tumblr these days?  But Tumblr's an accessibility nightmare!  So I really hope this forum hangs in.  It's really wonderful to have a user-friendly place to discuss POTO!  :-) And will do my bit to help publicize too.

Hello Blind Phan, am glad if I in any way have helped to spread the information about the original /old phantomoftheopera.com. Yes, it was indeed a wonderful place and I still miss it very much. I do still feed my Phantom obsession in various ways... Sites like the old phantomoftheopera.com and this one, work the best for me, for continuing discussions about the different aspects of phantom, thanks to the forum and "threads" structure... I just haven't got the hang of Tumblr, and sites like Facebook are just no good for discussions that go on over a long period of time.

Karin Willison? I think you can find her on Facebook these days. She seems to be leading an active and interesting life, but doesn't mention Phantom very much.

Are there any particular aspects of Phantom that interest you, Blind Phan? Please excuse me if this is a superfluous question, the answer may be somewhere on this site, but I have not been around here very much lately.

Jennie wrote:
Sites like the old phantomoftheopera.com and this one, work the best for me, for continuing discussions about the different aspects of phantom, thanks to the forum and "threads" structure... I just haven't got the hang of Tumblr, and sites like Facebook are just no good for discussions that go on over a long period of time.

I agree with that, and now another forum, "The Phantom's Opera," appears to have vanished. Like this one, there had been very little traffic on it lately. I don't really know how websites work, but I imagine that banner advertising helps support them, and if there are not enough hits, that support may be withdrawn.  The old phantomoftheopera.com site had a very large membership, so there was quite a lot of activity on it.  With its demise, and the mushrooming of other social platforms on the internet, I suppose the membership just scattered.  I am a member of a Facebook group, "The Phantom of the Opera phans," and some interesting items get posted, but as Jennie said, Facebook doesn't work for long discussions of a single topic - things just "fall off the bottom of the page" in a matter of days, and it's too difficult to find them again.

Does Admin or anyone know, is this site at risk of closing?  If it is, would it be worth asking members to visit/ post more often?  There are nearly 500 members, but fewer than 30 have logged on this year. Maybe forums just aren't wanted any more and are doomed to extinction.  But I'd be sad to see that happen.

MarySkater wrote:

Jennie wrote:
Sites like the old phantomoftheopera.com and this one, work the best for me, for continuing discussions about the different aspects of phantom, thanks to the forum and "threads" structure... I just haven't got the hang of Tumblr, and sites like Facebook are just no good for discussions that go on over a long period of time.

I agree with that, and now another forum, "The Phantom's Opera," appears to have vanished. Like this one, there had been very little traffic on it lately. I don't really know how websites work, but I imagine that banner advertising helps support them, and if there are not enough hits, that support may be withdrawn.  The old phantomoftheopera.com site had a very large membership, so there was quite a lot of activity on it.  With its demise, and the mushrooming of other social platforms on the internet, I suppose the membership just scattered.  I am a member of a Facebook group, "The Phantom of the Opera phans," and some interesting items get posted, but as Jennie said, Facebook doesn't work for long discussions of a single topic - things just "fall off the bottom of the page" in a matter of days, and it's too difficult to find them again.

Does Admin or anyone know, is this site at risk of closing?  If it is, would it be worth asking members to visit/ post more often?  There are nearly 500 members, but fewer than 30 have logged on this year. Maybe forums just aren't wanted any more and are doomed to extinction.  But I'd be sad to see that happen.

Mary, this hosting site, forumotion.net is free, so there is no expiration date as I understand it. As long as Operafantomet who set it up, wants to keep it going, it should be doing ok. You could try sending her a pm and voice your concern. Let me know if she doesn't respond and I'll get in touch with her through other channels....

I'd be very sad to see this site disappear, even if I haven't been very active on it lately. Every now and then my obsession interest for Phantom flares up again, like a firework in the night, and I go through a phase of intense involvement... have a project I'd like to have time to revive again, but life has been getting in the way....